This article was written by KV Ramesh and orginally published in Swar Aalap on 5th July 2009. The interview with Usha Khanna was done by Ramesh a few weeks before the article was published . All credits belong to Swar Aalap
 | Think of Hindi film music and names of those prolific music composers immediately come to mind. We have grown and lived with hundreds of their compositions that have seldom failed to touch our hearts. Among the list of the many great composers, were two female composers who made their own individual mark and reputation. We are talking of Saraswati Devi and Usha Khanna. |
Saraswati Devi was not only India's first female music director but was also amongst the most prolific ones in the first two decades of talkie films (1930s & 1940s). It was due to her hit song, “main ban ki chidiya, ban ke sang sang” from 'Achhut Kanya' (1935), that HMV decided to regularly make and promote gramophone records of film songs. The runaway success of this gramophone disc kick started the promotion of a new genre of Indian Music – film Music/Song.
On the other hand, Usha Khanna's career started off with a big bang in 1959 with the landmark score 'Dil Deke Dekho'. Born in 1942 in Gwalior, Usha Khanna made her own in Hindi film music, a field, where male composers have known to dominate. She remained active for more than 3 decades from the 1960s to 1990s, her last film being in 2003!
Introduced by stalwart film-maker Sashadhar Mukherjee, Usha Khanna went on to give some memorable and popular music in movies like 'Hum Hindustani', 'Shabnam', 'Hawas', 'Honeymoon' 'Souten' and 'Aap To Aise Na The'. Besides these, there are many individual songs that did not make it to the charts, but are yet regarded classy compositions. For e.g. “Mere dil pe andhera sa chaane laga”, “Mera tumhara saath to” and “Ajnabi kaun ho tum, jabse tumhein dekha hai” are songs that any music connoisseur would die for!
Though Usha Khanna often collaborated with singers Asha Bhosle and Mohammed Rafi, she gave opportunities to many upcoming singers like Anupama Deshpande, Pankaj Udhas, Hemlata, Mohammed Aziz, Roop Kumar Rathod, Shabbir Kumar, and Sonu Nigam. She herself sang a few songs as playback singer, her most popular song being “Pal bhar ke liye koi hamein” from the movie 'Johnny Mera Naam"
On the other hand, Usha Khanna's career started off with a big bang in 1959 with the landmark score 'Dil Deke Dekho'. Born in 1942 in Gwalior, Usha Khanna made her own in Hindi film music, a field, where male composers have known to dominate. She remained active for more than 3 decades from the 1960s to 1990s, her last film being in 2003!
Introduced by stalwart film-maker Sashadhar Mukherjee, Usha Khanna went on to give some memorable and popular music in movies like 'Hum Hindustani', 'Shabnam', 'Hawas', 'Honeymoon' 'Souten' and 'Aap To Aise Na The'. Besides these, there are many individual songs that did not make it to the charts, but are yet regarded classy compositions. For e.g. “Mere dil pe andhera sa chaane laga”, “Mera tumhara saath to” and “Ajnabi kaun ho tum, jabse tumhein dekha hai” are songs that any music connoisseur would die for!
Though Usha Khanna often collaborated with singers Asha Bhosle and Mohammed Rafi, she gave opportunities to many upcoming singers like Anupama Deshpande, Pankaj Udhas, Hemlata, Mohammed Aziz, Roop Kumar Rathod, Shabbir Kumar, and Sonu Nigam. She herself sang a few songs as playback singer, her most popular song being “Pal bhar ke liye koi hamein” from the movie 'Johnny Mera Naam"
The Interview
Ramesh K V met Usha Khanna at her residence to discover more about the lady, her early days and prolonged music making career.
Ramesh: Please tell us about your childhood days. Did you learn music when you were young?
Usha Khannaji: My father, Manohar Khanna, was a music teacher. He used to work with the Water works for the Maharaja of Gwalior. Whenever there was a function of the Scindias, father would go to sing there. I stayed with my father most of the times as I had a twin brother who used to be a bit sick and stay with my mother. Father would get up at 6 am in the morning and sing. He would have the Harmonium inside a 'Rajaai' and me in his arms. “When I would start singing, you would be quiet. Else you would be crying. When you were three years old, you had started singing 'Saa re gaa'” he would say later. I think it has been a gift for me. I have never learnt anything in music.
Ramesh: I had read that your father was a lyricist and had entered the film world in the 1950s…
Usha Khannaji: Yes. He first worked in Nargis Art where he used to write. He didn't make it as expected and had me to look after. I was around 16 or 17 when we later came to Bombay.
Ramesh: He wrote songs with the name Javed-Anwar. Why was that?
Usha Khannaji: Javed was my father's penname and Anwar was one of my father's friends in Aligarh.
Ramesh: How many films did he write songs for?
Usha Khannaji: Cannot remember, but many. He wrote maximum with me during my early days.
Ramesh: I had read that he scored music for a Kashmiri film 'Pamposh' in 1953. Did he give music for any more movies?
Usha Khannaji: Not to my knowledge. I think that was the only film he did.
Ramesh: Tell us what made you to come from Gwalior to Bombay?
Usha Khannaji: Father gave up the work at Nargis Art and called all of us here in Bombay. He wanted to remain in Bollywood; we all settled in Bombay.
Ramesh: How did you get initiated to film music? You had also learnt music from Robin Banerjee…..?
Usha Khannaji: I had initially wanted to become a singer. My father wanted me to learn music from a formal teacher. I began to learn from Robinji, for a period of about 1 year. I also later learnt Classical music from Padmini Kolhapure's father. Well-known lyricist Indivar frequently visited our house during those days. He got me in to the habit of making tunes for his lyrics. He used to like the fact that I was making tunes for his words. He one day told me “I will take you to Sashadhar Mukherjee”. When we met Mukherjee Saab, he asked me “Do you sing better than Lata?” I said “No”. He then asked “Do you sing better than Asha”? I said “No” “Then why do you want to be a singer”, he asked. I said “At least I want to try. If you give me a chance, I can try and become a singer”. He said 'I will have to think about it”. Then, when Indivarji said “This girl makes good tunes, do hear them”, he agreed.
This was during the making of 'Dil Deke Dekho' (1959).I had made tunes on dummy words written by father and so I sang it out to him. He got up and asked “Who made them?” I said “I did”. He could not believe I had made those tunes. Nayyar Saab was very strong then as composer. Then he asked “Who told you to make these tunes?” When I said “I made them myself”, he asked me to come to his Studio the next day. When we went the next day, he asked me “Would you like to become a Music Director?” I said “You can make me one!”
That was how I started going to Filmalaya studios. He used to pay me Rs. 1000 per month. This went on for a year. Every day he would come and listen to my tunes. He kept me in training for a year to find out whether I could make tunes or not.
Ramesh: You must have made many tunes in one year….
Usha Khannaji: Sashadharji kept me engaged by asking me to play new tunes every day. He would choose only those songs that he felt would be successful. He understood music very well and had a good ear for music.
Ramesh: 'Dil deke dekho' was released in 1959. You were just 16 at that time. It must have been a big event in your life…..
Usha Khannaji: Yes. I had some photos of the movie premiere….…I wore two pigtails with ribbons, standing along with Asha Parekh, Shammi Kapoor. They were all wondering where this girl came from.
All I would say now is it has been a gift for me. I have no idea about any Raga or Taal, but I can know and understand with my ears.
Ramesh: Tell us something more about the making of 'Dil deke dekho'
Usha Khannaji: One day when I came to the Studios, Shammiji asked “Aye ladki, idhar aa. What tune have you made? Anything new?” Since I had the habit of making tunes from lyrics, I got inspired by the song's words and 'Shaayri'. So I sang the tune “Hum aur tum aur ye sama”. “This is a very good song” Shammiji exclaimed and called Nasir (Hussain) Saab to listen to the tune.Nasir Saab was reluctant to include the song since the movie was already completed. Shammiji then called Sashadhar Mukherjee and made him listen to the song. Sashadharji heard the song and said “Okay keep this one too”. Now there was no place (in the movie) but because of the song, he kept one Mukhda and one Antara in the movie. The movie's audio record has two Mukhdas and Antaras . The entire Dil deke dekho' crew was very loving because of which I never felt I was going for a recording. One day, while I was making a tune, Sashadharji said 'Usha, stop. He told an office boy “Tell Nayyar Saab that I have called him”. When Nayyar Saab came, he asked “Who is this”? Sashadharji introduced me to him saying “This is Usha, Usha Khanna. She wants to meet you”. I still remember I was trembling in front of them! When I sang the song “Pyaar ho to keh do yes”, Nayyar Saab was taken aback for a moment and then he asked Sashadharji if he got it made from someone else and was giving it the publicity. Sashadharji immediately said “Usha is making it” Nayyar Saab was so happy that he said “You are my 'Putri-Paathshaala'. That's what he used to call me. “Only she can do it in my style”, he used to say about me.
Ramesh: Is there any other song, the success of which, you owe to lyrics?
Usha Khannaji: Well, there was “Teri galiyon me na rakhenge kadam” from 'Hawas'. The song had to be sung by Rafi Saab. Sawanji (Kumar) was writing it. I told him 'You write and we will make a tune out of that'. Thus the song was composed; it was a big hit. He later asked me why I didn't make my tune before. I told him “Your lyrics and expression come first; the tune will then be made”. There are very few songs in which I did the tune first (and then the lyrics followed).
Ramesh: By and large, industry practice is to make the tune first. But with you, the lyrics came first followed by the tune. Why is that?
Usha Khannaji: I believe the song-writer should get a clear field to write a song. If I make a tune (hums a tune) first, that becomes a restriction for him. What the song writer wants to express may not come out clearly. So I ask the song-writer to write the words first. I then make the tune from those words. This ensures freedom for the song-writer, which is more enjoyable and satisfying.
Ramesh: After the success of 'Dil Deke Dekho' you seem to have done just 2 movies each year till about mid-late 1960s. Was there any reason?
Usha Khannaji: The reason is simple. I am a woman. In our industry stories start if a man and woman are seen together. Nobody cares if its brother, uncle, etc. However, my father was strict. I never used to go to any parties. It is also necessary for a music director to meet and impress producers and directors. Some of them used to ask me to come to places like Khandala for long music sessions. I could not obviously go. Later, my father said “If you continue like this, your career will be finished. Take any movie that comes along.” That's how I started taking more B and C grade movies. But the music in most of these movies was liked by music lovers.
Ramesh: 'Hum Hindustani', released in 1960, had very good music…. “Chodo kal ki baatein”, “Maajhi meri kismet ki” and “Hum jab chaley to” by Rafi Saab.
Usha Khannaji: Yes, the music score were well-received by music listeners.
Ramesh: Then there was a film called 'Flat no.9'…..the song “Gaa diwane jhoomke” was well-known. And another hit film – 'Aao Pyar Karen' in 1964. Rafi Saab's “Jahan tu hai wahan phir” is a beautiful song..….
Usha Khannaji: The Lata Mangeshkar solo “Meri daastan mujhe bhi, mera dil sunake roye” (Hums the tune) was special. I'll tell you a story. When this song was played on Radio, Madan Mohanji phoned me and said. “Hello Usha. What a song you have made. I want to congratulate you for this song”. The song was a light Ghazal. I couldn't believe that Madanji had heard this song. That was a compliment for me.
Ramesh: Year 1965 had the famous song “Hum tumse juda hoke” from 'Ek Sapera Ek Lutera'.
Usha Khannaji: Yes, the song had nice flute pieces that were played by Hariji (Flautist Hariprasad Chaurasia).
Ramesh: The movie had a few more songs. The song “Tera ban jaun kahin ye meri taqdeer nahin” has a Shankar-Jaikishan (SJ) touch to it….
Usha Khannaji: Shankar-Jaikishan have always been by inspiration.
Ramesh: In fact, “Teri adaaon pe mar mar gaye hum” from 'Shabnam' during the same period is very much SJ style. Would you agree?
Usha Khannaji: Yes. Some people used to say that it was SJ and not me!
Ramesh: Based on 'Dil Deke Dekho', one would think your inspiration was Nayyar Saab….
Usha Khannaji: No, I considered Shankar-Jaikishan to be my inspiration. In many of my songs, you will find the Violin and Accordion. You will mostly see the SJ style. Not the Nayyar Saab style.
Ramesh: There was the Mannada song “Apne liye, jiye to kya jiye, tu jee aye dil, zamane ke liye' from 'Badal' during the same time that was also popular…..
Usha Khannaji: This song was also written first. My father wrote it. Similarly, every song of 'Shabnam' was written first and then the tune was made. Father and his friend Anwar wrote them. Though father used to write more in Urdu, he knew Hindi equally well. It was just that Urdu Shaayri was more prominent. All the songs of 'Shabnam' – “Ye teri saadgi”, “Maine rakha hai mohabbat” and “Teri adaaon pe mar mar gaye hum” were hits.
Ramesh: “Chodo kal ki baatein” from 'Hum Hindustani' comes out as a perfectly balanced patriotic song. How was your experience working with singer Mukeshji?
Usha Khannaji: He was a wonderful man. He would say 'Tell me what tune you have made'. I would say 'Is it really necessary for you to listen to my tune?”. He would say “Till we learn from you new tunes, we will never be able to sing. I am no singer. I am just a 'Chalta hua' singer”. He was very interested in food. He would tell me 'Tell your mother to make Matti and Tea” He would come all the way from Napean Sea road to drink the Tea and do rehearsals for my song. You don't get to see such artistes these days.
Ramesh: He had unique depth in his voice. What other specialty do you think he had?
Usha Khannaji: It was a round voice. His word and diction was very clear. I would say it was straight singing without any vocal acrobatics.
Ramesh: Then there was 'Lal Bangla' with Rafi Saab's “Haseen waadiyon”. Tell us about your association with Rafi Saab who you teamed with for a number of memorable songs.
Usha Khannaji: Rafi Saab was a very simple man. He would say “Namastey. Come let's rehearse”. He would always rehearse out at home. He would be more or less ready in the Studio…at the most maybe one or two rehearsals in the Studio to see how the song sounded on the mike. He would write down, whatever I would say, in Urdu. While singing, he would always ask “Is it okay”? He was very encouraging.
Ramesh: During your initial years, most of your songs were by Lata Mangeshkar but later it was Asha Bhosle. What would you say about differences in their singing styles?
Usha Khannaji: Latadidi was very good at melodies. Ashaji also was, but always used to feel she was being used only for cabaret songs. There was this song by Asha “Haye tabassum tera” from 'Nishaan'. When she rendered this song, she asked me “Why don't people give me songs like this?” Both of them were very supportive to me.
I remember after we had recorded “Main teri choti behna” for 'Souten', Lataji had asked to “Increase the sur by one note”. Though my assistants were worried about writing the notations all over again, we rewrote everything and then recorded it. And the song was well appreciated.
Ramesh: With singers like Ashaji, Rafi Saab, Lataji, how were the recordings done? Were there many rehearsals?
Usha Khannaji: These singers – Rafi Saab, Ashaji, and Latadidi – they were all specially made by Goddess Saraswati. They would just listen to the tune but polish and sing it. They would never do anything extra to the tune. Latadidi was simply outstanding. When I would start singing slowly, she would say “Go on Usha, sing”. She would simultaneously make notes on my pauses or any improvisations. She would listen to the song once. When I would repeat, by the third time, she would start humming along with me. By the fourth time she would sing some part of the 'Mukhda'. By the fifth time she would be ready with the entire song. And when she finally sang on the mic, one was never able to say that she had just learnt the song! There are no such singers now!
Ramesh: Your association with Kishoreda began in the late 1960s…Probably with 'Hai mera dil' and the song “Bas qayamat ho gayi”………
Usha Khannaji: For Kishoreda, we had to send cassettes of our tunes. I have a nice incident to narrate on Kishoreda during the making of “Zindagi pyar ka geet hai” from 'Souten'. While on his way to the recording, he called to tell me he was going back home. I said “Kishoreda we are all waiting for you. What happened?” He changed his voice and said “I am not well. My voice is not okay”. I pleaded to him “Dada you know Famous (studio) has big problem in that they don't have a track system”. He just said “No, tomorrow pakka” and kept the phone down. Fifteen to thirty minutes had passed and suddenly Kishoreda arrived, saying “Take karo, take karo”. I asked “Dada, you had said you are not coming”. To which he replied “Sorry, I was mistaken. I was listening to some other tune and not yours. I heard this tune so came back.” He had heard the tune in my voice. He was one of a kind.
Ramesh: You teamed with Mannada in the movie 'Badal'. Did you ever work with him again?
Usha Khannaji: Sadly No. I never got the opportunity
Ramesh: You have used singers like Hemlata and Suman Kalyanpur a lot…….
Usha Khannaji: It was very simple. Some producers couldn't afford to pay the price. Suman could of course sing very well. I introduced Hemlata in the movie 'Ek Phool EK bhool' with the song “Dus paise mein ram le lo”
Ramesh: There is a lovely duet of Suman Kalyanpur “Mera tumhara saath to” in 'Ek Paheli (1971). How did you make such wonderful tunes?
Usha Khannaji: Just happened. (Laughs)
Ramesh: You yourself have sung quite a few songs. The super-hit song “Pal bhar ke liye” from Kalyanji- Anandji's 'Johnny Mera Naam' had your humming. So would you say your wish to be a singer was fulfilled?
Usha Khannaji: (Again laughs) I did sing some songs…started as early as for Roshanji with “Paapi hai pet paapi” along with Ashaji in the movie 'Wanted'
Ramesh: The late 1960s period of your career saw less-heard movies like 'Faisla' 'Mai Wohi Hoon' 'Insaaf' and 'Kaun Ho Tum'. Did any of these movies have popular or hit songs?
Usha Khannaji: 'Insaaf' had a Mukesh-Asha duet “Ye tune kya kaha, kaha hoga” that was popular.
Ramesh: That song sounds a bit like Laxmikant-Pyarelal's (LP) style…….
Usha Khannaji: I made it with SJ in mind. Of course, LP also followed SJ's style. They too were my good friends. When I told them I liked the music of their movie 'Hero', Pyareji was surprised and remarked “Ushaji, nowadays no music director is interested in praising someone else's work”. I said “Pyareji what's good has to be admired”. I have made many friends in the industry. I never had any problems with my musicians too. They would agree to sit for as many rehearsals I requested to complete a song.
Ramesh: One can hear glimpses of many music directors in your music. Sometimes SJ, Sometimes LP, sometimes Nayyar Saab….
Usha Khannaji: Laxmikantji called me once, “Ushaji, I have a bet with my wife. My wife insists that “Tu is tarah se meri zindagi me shamil hai” from 'Aap To Aise Na The' is by Laxmikant- Pyarelal and not by Usha Khanna”. I think that answers your question. Yes, you will find everyone's style or color as I listen to good songs from every Music Director. But in the end, I ensure to put my own style or stamp on the songs.
Ramesh: The Kishoreda number “Jee bhar ke dekh loon mai tumhein” from 'Deedar' had a slight Pancham and Kalyanji-Anandji touch…
Usha Khannaji: You will find this. My tunes always have some color of the others. Of course, my final stamp will be there. You will also not know sometimes whose style I have used. I believe if one gets inspired and likes it, he or she should take it. I would listen to all styles but finally make my own. I liked Annu Malik's song “Raja ko raani se pyar ho gaya” and used that as inspiration for music in the TV serial Kora Kagaz. Asha Parekh told me that the serial's theme song was a hit and boosted the serial a lot.
Ramesh: Should a composer keep in mind every other music director's style while composing?
Usha Khannaji: Yes, because you have to know the styles of music that are popular. But ultimately, the stamp on the song should be your own.
Ramesh: Which music directors of the 1960s and 70s were your personal favorites?
Usha Khannaji: Shankar-Jaikishan, of course. They were also my inspiration.
Ramesh: I was watching their movie 'Jaanwar' yesterday. The song “Meri mohabat jawan rahegi” still echoes in my head…..
Usha Khannaji: Yes; because, it's a simple tune with simple lyrics. I really salute them for this.
Ramesh: Did you ever wish you had made any of their compositions?
Usha Khannaji: I can't make a song like them. I remember most of their music, though
Ramesh: Did they ever appreciate any of your work?
Usha Khannaji: Shankarji used to appreciate me. He would call me for tea at Famous Studio and sing a tune with his Harmonium…in French, Spanish and so on. Jaikishanji's was a more romantic style. I never had too much interaction with him.
Ramesh: Your thoughts about other composers - Roshan, Jaidev……
Usha Khannaji: These were composers who put their own color or style in their music. Nayyar Saab made it Punjabi-folk oriented and made it popular in those days – this is being done nowadays too. We have done many things in those days; nowadays they are just catching on. So there is nothing in today's music I feel we cannot do. Today's music style takes some time for me to understand. On the contrary, take any of the old composers' songs - they had easy rhythm and simple tunes. And chances are you will know most of the songs!
Ramesh: How about Hemant Kumar as a composer?
Usha Khannaji: Another great musician. What songs he made! (Hums “Kuch dil ne kaha” from 'Anupama')
Ramesh: What do you have to say about Salilda?
Usha Khannaji: What a music director! He gave his own color to music. His songs are not easy to sing. Only Lataji could sing those tough tunes. Too any variations, I can't make anything like them. But when you listen to his songs, you find they are sweet to hear!
Ramesh: What's your opinion of RD Burman (Pancham)?
Usha Khannaji: He was a brilliant music director. He had knowledge of everything. He knew what to do on the recording machine. Of course, he was a master of rhythm too. He had his own unique style, which later Jatin-Lalit took to. His music also had lots of melody (Hums the tune “Kya janoon sajan hoti hai kya”). One goes crazy with the melody. When I listen to such songs, I always wish I had made them. I feel angry about the fact that Pancham's music is being remixed today.
Ramesh: How was your relationship with senior composers like Dada Burman and Naushad Saab?
Usha Khannaji: I never got to meet Burmanda, though he stayed close to my place. He would go walking past my building daily. Naushad Saab was very loving. Most music directors had a good relationship with me.
Ramesh: We have heard the story of how Roshan Saab called up Burmanda and congratulated him on the song “Hum bekhudi me tumko”…Apparently, he said he wished he had made that tune. Was there any such incident with you?
Usha Khannaji: Can't remember any. My composing style is quick. I never do a sitting in the real sense. My machine (brain) starts working immediately. By and large I make a tune within 10 minutes. Else it doesn't happen….
Ramesh: Then, did any of your songs take longer to compose?
Usha Khannaji: Not really... For me if it doesn't happen in the first few minutes, it won't happen even if I sit for long and make 10 more tunes.
Ramesh: How much importance do you give to a song situation?
Usha Khannaji: I am more interested in the mood of the situation. If one is able to get the mood, it is enough. If you ask me which Raga or Taal, I don't know anything. But I can make a song in that Raga and Taal. When I made music, I had very good assistants like Kishore Sharma. In fact Kishore would tell me “Boss, how do you make tunes like this?' My later assistant Amar Haldipur would say 'I have never seen such a fast music director. Ushaji gets the lyrics and right-away makes a tune”. Poet Kulwant Jani would say “If Usha gets a newspaper; she will make a tune out of that too”
Ramesh: Did you ever make alternate tunes for a song situation? We have heard that many composers used to make 2 or 3 different tunes for the same song situation…..
Usha Khannaji: Not readily, but in front of the producer, no one can say anything. If he says he does not like a particular song, then that is final. You need to get another song, another tune!
Ramesh: What, in your opinion, should be an ideal mix for a successful song? Lyrics, good tune, singer's input……
Usha Khannaji: In my opinion, all three should be the same. The singer really can't move away from the tune or the lyrics. He has to think about how and who made the tune. He has to play his role by singing well to the song situation. Most yesteryear singers stayed within the music director's tune and gave great output. None of the singers - Rafi, Kishore, Mukesh, Lata, and Asha - ever asked me if they could add their bit to the tune. But, when necessary, they did contribute to boost the song. There was a Rafi-Kishore comedy song in 'Zamana' where Kishoreda took my permission and added the line “Laung elachi khaane chala'. Such singers don't come often.
Ramesh: Is it important to have a musically knowledgeable producer? Like Sashadhar Mukherjee?
Usha Khannaji: Yes. Even Sawanji (Sawan Kumar Tak) had good music knowledge. It was nice working with him.
Ramesh: Who were your music arrangers?
Usha Khannaji: First there was Sonikji (from Sonik Omi). Then it was Jaykumar Parte. He arranged the well-known song “Shaam dekho dhal rahi hai” from 'Anjaan Hai Koi', which I sang with Rafi Saab.
Ramesh: Wasn't Amar Haldipur also your arranger?
Usha Khannaji: That was only for a few songs. When Jaykumar Parte became a music director himself, I called Kishore Sharma to do the arrangement. Kishore Sharma worked a lot with me. He was a Violinist first, and then became an arranger. Later, he also became a music director, giving music as duo Kishore-Mahesh.
Ramesh: Which music instruments did you prefer for your songs? Indian or Western?
Usha Khannaji: More Indian. But the Accordion and Violin were must haves. Musician Kersi Lord played a lot for me.
Ramesh: It is said that Salil Chowdhury's music was influenced by Western classical. Did your music have any such influences?
Usha Khannaji: Nothing particular, though I like to listen to symphonies
Ramesh: Let us move to some of your less-heard but memorable songs…. “Mere dil pe andhera sa chaane laga” for actor Sudhir in the movie 'Ek Phool ek bhool'.
Usha Khannaji: I looked at him and made the song (laughs).
Ramesh: Then the Rafi Saab sung “Sau baar banaakar maalik ne” from 'Ek Raat', with magnificent lyrics by Yogeshji…
Usha Khannaji: Yes, but the Mukesh song “Aaj tumse door hokar aise roya mera pyar” from the movie was a hit.
Ramesh: 'Tanhai' had the romantic “Bheege huey aanchal mein sameto na badan ko” sung by Kishoreda…..
Usha Khannaji: I would say special lyrics on which I made the tune.
Ramesh: 'Hawas' had two cabaret songs. “Aao yaaron, gaao” and “Apne dil me jagah deejiye” which is very Nayyar-saab style….
Usha Khannaji: Yes. It is. Ashaji was singing so I made it in Nayyar Saab style. (Sings the tune) I enjoyed making the song.
Ramesh: Who played the wonderful guitar in “Aao yaaron gaao”?
Usha Khannaji: Gorakh Sharma, Laxmikant - Pyarelal's assistant
Ramesh: 'Hotel' had the sweet song “Dekho pyaar mein aisa nahi karte”
Usha Khannaji: It had two versions; one each by Amit Kumar and Manhar Udhas.
Ramesh: 'Aap to aise na the' in 1981 had “Tu is tarah se meri zindagi mein”. Why were there three singers for the song?
Usha Khannaji: Because of three characters in the movie. So the three singes had three colors to the same tune. Rafi Saab heard this tune and blessed me saying “Jeete rahiye,kya gaana hai”. Sadly, that was his last song for me. During the recording he closed his eyes while singing. He even told the producer (Mohan Kumar) that the movie would be a hit because of this song. He liked it so much.
Ramesh: You also gave music in some Malayalam movies like 'Mudal Manju' and 'Agni Nilavu'
Usha Khannaji: Yes. “Nee madhupagaru” from Mudal Manju' by Yesudas was a hit song
Ramesh: How did you get a chance to do Malayalam movies?
Usha Khannaji: Well, music doesn't have any language. Yesudas took me to Kerala. When I got the offer to do Malayalam films, I told him I don't know Malayalam. But he just asked me to make the tunes. I had made some songs for Onam (a Kerala festival) also. They were not very popular.
Ramesh: What's your opinion about Yesudas?
Usha Khannaji: Excellent singer. What a voice, He should have taken more interest in working here (Hindi Films). But he spent more time in the south because he was No. 1 there. As you know, he got the Filmfare award for “Dil ke tukde” from 'Dada'
Ramesh: I read about a Malayalam song that S. Janaki, South India's popular singer, sang for you. What was your experience working ith her?
Usha Khannaji: When I saw her first, I was astonished when she sang in front of the mike. The lips moved, with not a single expression on her face. Whether it was the high or low pitch, the expressions were same; basically effortless. The same was with Rafi Saab and Lataji. Sometimes Kishoreda would have some expression on his face.
Ramesh: Since we are talking of South, did you get a chance to interact with composers from there? Vishwanathan- Ramamoorthy, Illaiyaraja?
Usha Khannaji: I met Illaiyaraja once; this was at Prasad studios. He had got some award at that time. I wanted to give him a bouquet and congratulate him. He knew about me and took me to a recording of two background scores that he was then doing. I saw him make the background music - he called his assistant, took a pen and paper. Saying “Ready Reel 5”, he just looked at the screen, wrote down the notations and gave it to his assistant. It was truly amazing. During our times, the film reel had to be played again and again. Some people are truly gifted. I think he is one of God's special people.
Ramesh: Did you get to meet music composers from other regions?
Usha Khannaji: Not really.
Ramesh: You were also nominated for a Filmfare Award for 'Souten'……..
Usha Khannaji: Yes. But Pancham got it. After all he was my partner. I used to call him partner.
Ramesh: Your last movie was in 2003.
Usha Khannaji: Yes. 'Dil pardesi ho gaya'. It was Sawanji's movie. Sonu Nigam, the singer, was very happy about the songs but the movie didn't run. So the songs also sank.
Ramesh: Did you ever in your career feel that your songs would have been popular had the movie been successful?
Usha Khannaji: Many times. But I accept that however good a music director is, if the movie is not a hit, not many people will remember the songs. Only the real music lovers will. Take the example of the movie 'Souten'. The movie was a hit and so were the songs. Nobody will now believe that “Shaayad meri shaadi ka khayal” started as a sentence. Sawanji wrote it. The lyrics “Tumhe chai pe bulaya hai” does not make any meaning. But it was a big hit in the end.
Ramesh: You have answered many questions. But, I would like to ask you one more. Who is your favorite singer?
Usha Khannaji: I like all of them. It depends on the song and the situation. Because each singer has a unique style and class.
Ramesh: You also worked for some TV Serials…
Usha Khannaji: I gave music for the popular TV serials 'Shaktimaan' and 'Kora Kagaz'.
Ramesh: Do you listen to your songs again?
Usha Khannaji: No. It is an old habit of mine. Once I record a song, I leave it and let it be. I know I won't be able to make another one like that…..
Usha Khannaji: My father, Manohar Khanna, was a music teacher. He used to work with the Water works for the Maharaja of Gwalior. Whenever there was a function of the Scindias, father would go to sing there. I stayed with my father most of the times as I had a twin brother who used to be a bit sick and stay with my mother. Father would get up at 6 am in the morning and sing. He would have the Harmonium inside a 'Rajaai' and me in his arms. “When I would start singing, you would be quiet. Else you would be crying. When you were three years old, you had started singing 'Saa re gaa'” he would say later. I think it has been a gift for me. I have never learnt anything in music.
Ramesh: I had read that your father was a lyricist and had entered the film world in the 1950s…
Usha Khannaji: Yes. He first worked in Nargis Art where he used to write. He didn't make it as expected and had me to look after. I was around 16 or 17 when we later came to Bombay.
Ramesh: He wrote songs with the name Javed-Anwar. Why was that?
Usha Khannaji: Javed was my father's penname and Anwar was one of my father's friends in Aligarh.
Ramesh: How many films did he write songs for?
Usha Khannaji: Cannot remember, but many. He wrote maximum with me during my early days.
Ramesh: I had read that he scored music for a Kashmiri film 'Pamposh' in 1953. Did he give music for any more movies?
Usha Khannaji: Not to my knowledge. I think that was the only film he did.
Ramesh: Tell us what made you to come from Gwalior to Bombay?
Usha Khannaji: Father gave up the work at Nargis Art and called all of us here in Bombay. He wanted to remain in Bollywood; we all settled in Bombay.
Ramesh: How did you get initiated to film music? You had also learnt music from Robin Banerjee…..?
Usha Khannaji: I had initially wanted to become a singer. My father wanted me to learn music from a formal teacher. I began to learn from Robinji, for a period of about 1 year. I also later learnt Classical music from Padmini Kolhapure's father. Well-known lyricist Indivar frequently visited our house during those days. He got me in to the habit of making tunes for his lyrics. He used to like the fact that I was making tunes for his words. He one day told me “I will take you to Sashadhar Mukherjee”. When we met Mukherjee Saab, he asked me “Do you sing better than Lata?” I said “No”. He then asked “Do you sing better than Asha”? I said “No” “Then why do you want to be a singer”, he asked. I said “At least I want to try. If you give me a chance, I can try and become a singer”. He said 'I will have to think about it”. Then, when Indivarji said “This girl makes good tunes, do hear them”, he agreed.
This was during the making of 'Dil Deke Dekho' (1959).I had made tunes on dummy words written by father and so I sang it out to him. He got up and asked “Who made them?” I said “I did”. He could not believe I had made those tunes. Nayyar Saab was very strong then as composer. Then he asked “Who told you to make these tunes?” When I said “I made them myself”, he asked me to come to his Studio the next day. When we went the next day, he asked me “Would you like to become a Music Director?” I said “You can make me one!”
That was how I started going to Filmalaya studios. He used to pay me Rs. 1000 per month. This went on for a year. Every day he would come and listen to my tunes. He kept me in training for a year to find out whether I could make tunes or not.
Ramesh: You must have made many tunes in one year….
Usha Khannaji: Sashadharji kept me engaged by asking me to play new tunes every day. He would choose only those songs that he felt would be successful. He understood music very well and had a good ear for music.
Ramesh: 'Dil deke dekho' was released in 1959. You were just 16 at that time. It must have been a big event in your life…..
Usha Khannaji: Yes. I had some photos of the movie premiere….…I wore two pigtails with ribbons, standing along with Asha Parekh, Shammi Kapoor. They were all wondering where this girl came from.
All I would say now is it has been a gift for me. I have no idea about any Raga or Taal, but I can know and understand with my ears.
Ramesh: Tell us something more about the making of 'Dil deke dekho'
Usha Khannaji: One day when I came to the Studios, Shammiji asked “Aye ladki, idhar aa. What tune have you made? Anything new?” Since I had the habit of making tunes from lyrics, I got inspired by the song's words and 'Shaayri'. So I sang the tune “Hum aur tum aur ye sama”. “This is a very good song” Shammiji exclaimed and called Nasir (Hussain) Saab to listen to the tune.Nasir Saab was reluctant to include the song since the movie was already completed. Shammiji then called Sashadhar Mukherjee and made him listen to the song. Sashadharji heard the song and said “Okay keep this one too”. Now there was no place (in the movie) but because of the song, he kept one Mukhda and one Antara in the movie. The movie's audio record has two Mukhdas and Antaras . The entire Dil deke dekho' crew was very loving because of which I never felt I was going for a recording. One day, while I was making a tune, Sashadharji said 'Usha, stop. He told an office boy “Tell Nayyar Saab that I have called him”. When Nayyar Saab came, he asked “Who is this”? Sashadharji introduced me to him saying “This is Usha, Usha Khanna. She wants to meet you”. I still remember I was trembling in front of them! When I sang the song “Pyaar ho to keh do yes”, Nayyar Saab was taken aback for a moment and then he asked Sashadharji if he got it made from someone else and was giving it the publicity. Sashadharji immediately said “Usha is making it” Nayyar Saab was so happy that he said “You are my 'Putri-Paathshaala'. That's what he used to call me. “Only she can do it in my style”, he used to say about me.
Ramesh: Is there any other song, the success of which, you owe to lyrics?
Usha Khannaji: Well, there was “Teri galiyon me na rakhenge kadam” from 'Hawas'. The song had to be sung by Rafi Saab. Sawanji (Kumar) was writing it. I told him 'You write and we will make a tune out of that'. Thus the song was composed; it was a big hit. He later asked me why I didn't make my tune before. I told him “Your lyrics and expression come first; the tune will then be made”. There are very few songs in which I did the tune first (and then the lyrics followed).
Ramesh: By and large, industry practice is to make the tune first. But with you, the lyrics came first followed by the tune. Why is that?
Usha Khannaji: I believe the song-writer should get a clear field to write a song. If I make a tune (hums a tune) first, that becomes a restriction for him. What the song writer wants to express may not come out clearly. So I ask the song-writer to write the words first. I then make the tune from those words. This ensures freedom for the song-writer, which is more enjoyable and satisfying.
Ramesh: After the success of 'Dil Deke Dekho' you seem to have done just 2 movies each year till about mid-late 1960s. Was there any reason?
Usha Khannaji: The reason is simple. I am a woman. In our industry stories start if a man and woman are seen together. Nobody cares if its brother, uncle, etc. However, my father was strict. I never used to go to any parties. It is also necessary for a music director to meet and impress producers and directors. Some of them used to ask me to come to places like Khandala for long music sessions. I could not obviously go. Later, my father said “If you continue like this, your career will be finished. Take any movie that comes along.” That's how I started taking more B and C grade movies. But the music in most of these movies was liked by music lovers.
Ramesh: 'Hum Hindustani', released in 1960, had very good music…. “Chodo kal ki baatein”, “Maajhi meri kismet ki” and “Hum jab chaley to” by Rafi Saab.
Usha Khannaji: Yes, the music score were well-received by music listeners.
Ramesh: Then there was a film called 'Flat no.9'…..the song “Gaa diwane jhoomke” was well-known. And another hit film – 'Aao Pyar Karen' in 1964. Rafi Saab's “Jahan tu hai wahan phir” is a beautiful song..….
Usha Khannaji: The Lata Mangeshkar solo “Meri daastan mujhe bhi, mera dil sunake roye” (Hums the tune) was special. I'll tell you a story. When this song was played on Radio, Madan Mohanji phoned me and said. “Hello Usha. What a song you have made. I want to congratulate you for this song”. The song was a light Ghazal. I couldn't believe that Madanji had heard this song. That was a compliment for me.
Ramesh: Year 1965 had the famous song “Hum tumse juda hoke” from 'Ek Sapera Ek Lutera'.
Usha Khannaji: Yes, the song had nice flute pieces that were played by Hariji (Flautist Hariprasad Chaurasia).
Ramesh: The movie had a few more songs. The song “Tera ban jaun kahin ye meri taqdeer nahin” has a Shankar-Jaikishan (SJ) touch to it….
Usha Khannaji: Shankar-Jaikishan have always been by inspiration.
Ramesh: In fact, “Teri adaaon pe mar mar gaye hum” from 'Shabnam' during the same period is very much SJ style. Would you agree?
Usha Khannaji: Yes. Some people used to say that it was SJ and not me!
Ramesh: Based on 'Dil Deke Dekho', one would think your inspiration was Nayyar Saab….
Usha Khannaji: No, I considered Shankar-Jaikishan to be my inspiration. In many of my songs, you will find the Violin and Accordion. You will mostly see the SJ style. Not the Nayyar Saab style.
Ramesh: There was the Mannada song “Apne liye, jiye to kya jiye, tu jee aye dil, zamane ke liye' from 'Badal' during the same time that was also popular…..
Usha Khannaji: This song was also written first. My father wrote it. Similarly, every song of 'Shabnam' was written first and then the tune was made. Father and his friend Anwar wrote them. Though father used to write more in Urdu, he knew Hindi equally well. It was just that Urdu Shaayri was more prominent. All the songs of 'Shabnam' – “Ye teri saadgi”, “Maine rakha hai mohabbat” and “Teri adaaon pe mar mar gaye hum” were hits.
Ramesh: “Chodo kal ki baatein” from 'Hum Hindustani' comes out as a perfectly balanced patriotic song. How was your experience working with singer Mukeshji?
Usha Khannaji: He was a wonderful man. He would say 'Tell me what tune you have made'. I would say 'Is it really necessary for you to listen to my tune?”. He would say “Till we learn from you new tunes, we will never be able to sing. I am no singer. I am just a 'Chalta hua' singer”. He was very interested in food. He would tell me 'Tell your mother to make Matti and Tea” He would come all the way from Napean Sea road to drink the Tea and do rehearsals for my song. You don't get to see such artistes these days.
Ramesh: He had unique depth in his voice. What other specialty do you think he had?
Usha Khannaji: It was a round voice. His word and diction was very clear. I would say it was straight singing without any vocal acrobatics.
Ramesh: Then there was 'Lal Bangla' with Rafi Saab's “Haseen waadiyon”. Tell us about your association with Rafi Saab who you teamed with for a number of memorable songs.
Usha Khannaji: Rafi Saab was a very simple man. He would say “Namastey. Come let's rehearse”. He would always rehearse out at home. He would be more or less ready in the Studio…at the most maybe one or two rehearsals in the Studio to see how the song sounded on the mike. He would write down, whatever I would say, in Urdu. While singing, he would always ask “Is it okay”? He was very encouraging.
Ramesh: During your initial years, most of your songs were by Lata Mangeshkar but later it was Asha Bhosle. What would you say about differences in their singing styles?
Usha Khannaji: Latadidi was very good at melodies. Ashaji also was, but always used to feel she was being used only for cabaret songs. There was this song by Asha “Haye tabassum tera” from 'Nishaan'. When she rendered this song, she asked me “Why don't people give me songs like this?” Both of them were very supportive to me.
I remember after we had recorded “Main teri choti behna” for 'Souten', Lataji had asked to “Increase the sur by one note”. Though my assistants were worried about writing the notations all over again, we rewrote everything and then recorded it. And the song was well appreciated.
Ramesh: With singers like Ashaji, Rafi Saab, Lataji, how were the recordings done? Were there many rehearsals?
Usha Khannaji: These singers – Rafi Saab, Ashaji, and Latadidi – they were all specially made by Goddess Saraswati. They would just listen to the tune but polish and sing it. They would never do anything extra to the tune. Latadidi was simply outstanding. When I would start singing slowly, she would say “Go on Usha, sing”. She would simultaneously make notes on my pauses or any improvisations. She would listen to the song once. When I would repeat, by the third time, she would start humming along with me. By the fourth time she would sing some part of the 'Mukhda'. By the fifth time she would be ready with the entire song. And when she finally sang on the mic, one was never able to say that she had just learnt the song! There are no such singers now!
Ramesh: Your association with Kishoreda began in the late 1960s…Probably with 'Hai mera dil' and the song “Bas qayamat ho gayi”………
Usha Khannaji: For Kishoreda, we had to send cassettes of our tunes. I have a nice incident to narrate on Kishoreda during the making of “Zindagi pyar ka geet hai” from 'Souten'. While on his way to the recording, he called to tell me he was going back home. I said “Kishoreda we are all waiting for you. What happened?” He changed his voice and said “I am not well. My voice is not okay”. I pleaded to him “Dada you know Famous (studio) has big problem in that they don't have a track system”. He just said “No, tomorrow pakka” and kept the phone down. Fifteen to thirty minutes had passed and suddenly Kishoreda arrived, saying “Take karo, take karo”. I asked “Dada, you had said you are not coming”. To which he replied “Sorry, I was mistaken. I was listening to some other tune and not yours. I heard this tune so came back.” He had heard the tune in my voice. He was one of a kind.
Ramesh: You teamed with Mannada in the movie 'Badal'. Did you ever work with him again?
Usha Khannaji: Sadly No. I never got the opportunity
Ramesh: You have used singers like Hemlata and Suman Kalyanpur a lot…….
Usha Khannaji: It was very simple. Some producers couldn't afford to pay the price. Suman could of course sing very well. I introduced Hemlata in the movie 'Ek Phool EK bhool' with the song “Dus paise mein ram le lo”
Ramesh: There is a lovely duet of Suman Kalyanpur “Mera tumhara saath to” in 'Ek Paheli (1971). How did you make such wonderful tunes?
Usha Khannaji: Just happened. (Laughs)
Ramesh: You yourself have sung quite a few songs. The super-hit song “Pal bhar ke liye” from Kalyanji- Anandji's 'Johnny Mera Naam' had your humming. So would you say your wish to be a singer was fulfilled?
Usha Khannaji: (Again laughs) I did sing some songs…started as early as for Roshanji with “Paapi hai pet paapi” along with Ashaji in the movie 'Wanted'
Ramesh: The late 1960s period of your career saw less-heard movies like 'Faisla' 'Mai Wohi Hoon' 'Insaaf' and 'Kaun Ho Tum'. Did any of these movies have popular or hit songs?
Usha Khannaji: 'Insaaf' had a Mukesh-Asha duet “Ye tune kya kaha, kaha hoga” that was popular.
Ramesh: That song sounds a bit like Laxmikant-Pyarelal's (LP) style…….
Usha Khannaji: I made it with SJ in mind. Of course, LP also followed SJ's style. They too were my good friends. When I told them I liked the music of their movie 'Hero', Pyareji was surprised and remarked “Ushaji, nowadays no music director is interested in praising someone else's work”. I said “Pyareji what's good has to be admired”. I have made many friends in the industry. I never had any problems with my musicians too. They would agree to sit for as many rehearsals I requested to complete a song.
Ramesh: One can hear glimpses of many music directors in your music. Sometimes SJ, Sometimes LP, sometimes Nayyar Saab….
Usha Khannaji: Laxmikantji called me once, “Ushaji, I have a bet with my wife. My wife insists that “Tu is tarah se meri zindagi me shamil hai” from 'Aap To Aise Na The' is by Laxmikant- Pyarelal and not by Usha Khanna”. I think that answers your question. Yes, you will find everyone's style or color as I listen to good songs from every Music Director. But in the end, I ensure to put my own style or stamp on the songs.
Ramesh: The Kishoreda number “Jee bhar ke dekh loon mai tumhein” from 'Deedar' had a slight Pancham and Kalyanji-Anandji touch…
Usha Khannaji: You will find this. My tunes always have some color of the others. Of course, my final stamp will be there. You will also not know sometimes whose style I have used. I believe if one gets inspired and likes it, he or she should take it. I would listen to all styles but finally make my own. I liked Annu Malik's song “Raja ko raani se pyar ho gaya” and used that as inspiration for music in the TV serial Kora Kagaz. Asha Parekh told me that the serial's theme song was a hit and boosted the serial a lot.
Ramesh: Should a composer keep in mind every other music director's style while composing?
Usha Khannaji: Yes, because you have to know the styles of music that are popular. But ultimately, the stamp on the song should be your own.
Ramesh: Which music directors of the 1960s and 70s were your personal favorites?
Usha Khannaji: Shankar-Jaikishan, of course. They were also my inspiration.
Ramesh: I was watching their movie 'Jaanwar' yesterday. The song “Meri mohabat jawan rahegi” still echoes in my head…..
Usha Khannaji: Yes; because, it's a simple tune with simple lyrics. I really salute them for this.
Ramesh: Did you ever wish you had made any of their compositions?
Usha Khannaji: I can't make a song like them. I remember most of their music, though
Ramesh: Did they ever appreciate any of your work?
Usha Khannaji: Shankarji used to appreciate me. He would call me for tea at Famous Studio and sing a tune with his Harmonium…in French, Spanish and so on. Jaikishanji's was a more romantic style. I never had too much interaction with him.
Ramesh: Your thoughts about other composers - Roshan, Jaidev……
Usha Khannaji: These were composers who put their own color or style in their music. Nayyar Saab made it Punjabi-folk oriented and made it popular in those days – this is being done nowadays too. We have done many things in those days; nowadays they are just catching on. So there is nothing in today's music I feel we cannot do. Today's music style takes some time for me to understand. On the contrary, take any of the old composers' songs - they had easy rhythm and simple tunes. And chances are you will know most of the songs!
Ramesh: How about Hemant Kumar as a composer?
Usha Khannaji: Another great musician. What songs he made! (Hums “Kuch dil ne kaha” from 'Anupama')
Ramesh: What do you have to say about Salilda?
Usha Khannaji: What a music director! He gave his own color to music. His songs are not easy to sing. Only Lataji could sing those tough tunes. Too any variations, I can't make anything like them. But when you listen to his songs, you find they are sweet to hear!
Ramesh: What's your opinion of RD Burman (Pancham)?
Usha Khannaji: He was a brilliant music director. He had knowledge of everything. He knew what to do on the recording machine. Of course, he was a master of rhythm too. He had his own unique style, which later Jatin-Lalit took to. His music also had lots of melody (Hums the tune “Kya janoon sajan hoti hai kya”). One goes crazy with the melody. When I listen to such songs, I always wish I had made them. I feel angry about the fact that Pancham's music is being remixed today.
Ramesh: How was your relationship with senior composers like Dada Burman and Naushad Saab?
Usha Khannaji: I never got to meet Burmanda, though he stayed close to my place. He would go walking past my building daily. Naushad Saab was very loving. Most music directors had a good relationship with me.
Ramesh: We have heard the story of how Roshan Saab called up Burmanda and congratulated him on the song “Hum bekhudi me tumko”…Apparently, he said he wished he had made that tune. Was there any such incident with you?
Usha Khannaji: Can't remember any. My composing style is quick. I never do a sitting in the real sense. My machine (brain) starts working immediately. By and large I make a tune within 10 minutes. Else it doesn't happen….
Ramesh: Then, did any of your songs take longer to compose?
Usha Khannaji: Not really... For me if it doesn't happen in the first few minutes, it won't happen even if I sit for long and make 10 more tunes.
Ramesh: How much importance do you give to a song situation?
Usha Khannaji: I am more interested in the mood of the situation. If one is able to get the mood, it is enough. If you ask me which Raga or Taal, I don't know anything. But I can make a song in that Raga and Taal. When I made music, I had very good assistants like Kishore Sharma. In fact Kishore would tell me “Boss, how do you make tunes like this?' My later assistant Amar Haldipur would say 'I have never seen such a fast music director. Ushaji gets the lyrics and right-away makes a tune”. Poet Kulwant Jani would say “If Usha gets a newspaper; she will make a tune out of that too”
Ramesh: Did you ever make alternate tunes for a song situation? We have heard that many composers used to make 2 or 3 different tunes for the same song situation…..
Usha Khannaji: Not readily, but in front of the producer, no one can say anything. If he says he does not like a particular song, then that is final. You need to get another song, another tune!
Ramesh: What, in your opinion, should be an ideal mix for a successful song? Lyrics, good tune, singer's input……
Usha Khannaji: In my opinion, all three should be the same. The singer really can't move away from the tune or the lyrics. He has to think about how and who made the tune. He has to play his role by singing well to the song situation. Most yesteryear singers stayed within the music director's tune and gave great output. None of the singers - Rafi, Kishore, Mukesh, Lata, and Asha - ever asked me if they could add their bit to the tune. But, when necessary, they did contribute to boost the song. There was a Rafi-Kishore comedy song in 'Zamana' where Kishoreda took my permission and added the line “Laung elachi khaane chala'. Such singers don't come often.
Ramesh: Is it important to have a musically knowledgeable producer? Like Sashadhar Mukherjee?
Usha Khannaji: Yes. Even Sawanji (Sawan Kumar Tak) had good music knowledge. It was nice working with him.
Ramesh: Who were your music arrangers?
Usha Khannaji: First there was Sonikji (from Sonik Omi). Then it was Jaykumar Parte. He arranged the well-known song “Shaam dekho dhal rahi hai” from 'Anjaan Hai Koi', which I sang with Rafi Saab.
Ramesh: Wasn't Amar Haldipur also your arranger?
Usha Khannaji: That was only for a few songs. When Jaykumar Parte became a music director himself, I called Kishore Sharma to do the arrangement. Kishore Sharma worked a lot with me. He was a Violinist first, and then became an arranger. Later, he also became a music director, giving music as duo Kishore-Mahesh.
Ramesh: Which music instruments did you prefer for your songs? Indian or Western?
Usha Khannaji: More Indian. But the Accordion and Violin were must haves. Musician Kersi Lord played a lot for me.
Ramesh: It is said that Salil Chowdhury's music was influenced by Western classical. Did your music have any such influences?
Usha Khannaji: Nothing particular, though I like to listen to symphonies
Ramesh: Let us move to some of your less-heard but memorable songs…. “Mere dil pe andhera sa chaane laga” for actor Sudhir in the movie 'Ek Phool ek bhool'.
Usha Khannaji: I looked at him and made the song (laughs).
Ramesh: Then the Rafi Saab sung “Sau baar banaakar maalik ne” from 'Ek Raat', with magnificent lyrics by Yogeshji…
Usha Khannaji: Yes, but the Mukesh song “Aaj tumse door hokar aise roya mera pyar” from the movie was a hit.
Ramesh: 'Tanhai' had the romantic “Bheege huey aanchal mein sameto na badan ko” sung by Kishoreda…..
Usha Khannaji: I would say special lyrics on which I made the tune.
Ramesh: 'Hawas' had two cabaret songs. “Aao yaaron, gaao” and “Apne dil me jagah deejiye” which is very Nayyar-saab style….
Usha Khannaji: Yes. It is. Ashaji was singing so I made it in Nayyar Saab style. (Sings the tune) I enjoyed making the song.
Ramesh: Who played the wonderful guitar in “Aao yaaron gaao”?
Usha Khannaji: Gorakh Sharma, Laxmikant - Pyarelal's assistant
Ramesh: 'Hotel' had the sweet song “Dekho pyaar mein aisa nahi karte”
Usha Khannaji: It had two versions; one each by Amit Kumar and Manhar Udhas.
Ramesh: 'Aap to aise na the' in 1981 had “Tu is tarah se meri zindagi mein”. Why were there three singers for the song?
Usha Khannaji: Because of three characters in the movie. So the three singes had three colors to the same tune. Rafi Saab heard this tune and blessed me saying “Jeete rahiye,kya gaana hai”. Sadly, that was his last song for me. During the recording he closed his eyes while singing. He even told the producer (Mohan Kumar) that the movie would be a hit because of this song. He liked it so much.
Ramesh: You also gave music in some Malayalam movies like 'Mudal Manju' and 'Agni Nilavu'
Usha Khannaji: Yes. “Nee madhupagaru” from Mudal Manju' by Yesudas was a hit song
Ramesh: How did you get a chance to do Malayalam movies?
Usha Khannaji: Well, music doesn't have any language. Yesudas took me to Kerala. When I got the offer to do Malayalam films, I told him I don't know Malayalam. But he just asked me to make the tunes. I had made some songs for Onam (a Kerala festival) also. They were not very popular.
Ramesh: What's your opinion about Yesudas?
Usha Khannaji: Excellent singer. What a voice, He should have taken more interest in working here (Hindi Films). But he spent more time in the south because he was No. 1 there. As you know, he got the Filmfare award for “Dil ke tukde” from 'Dada'
Ramesh: I read about a Malayalam song that S. Janaki, South India's popular singer, sang for you. What was your experience working ith her?
Usha Khannaji: When I saw her first, I was astonished when she sang in front of the mike. The lips moved, with not a single expression on her face. Whether it was the high or low pitch, the expressions were same; basically effortless. The same was with Rafi Saab and Lataji. Sometimes Kishoreda would have some expression on his face.
Ramesh: Since we are talking of South, did you get a chance to interact with composers from there? Vishwanathan- Ramamoorthy, Illaiyaraja?
Usha Khannaji: I met Illaiyaraja once; this was at Prasad studios. He had got some award at that time. I wanted to give him a bouquet and congratulate him. He knew about me and took me to a recording of two background scores that he was then doing. I saw him make the background music - he called his assistant, took a pen and paper. Saying “Ready Reel 5”, he just looked at the screen, wrote down the notations and gave it to his assistant. It was truly amazing. During our times, the film reel had to be played again and again. Some people are truly gifted. I think he is one of God's special people.
Ramesh: Did you get to meet music composers from other regions?
Usha Khannaji: Not really.
Ramesh: You were also nominated for a Filmfare Award for 'Souten'……..
Usha Khannaji: Yes. But Pancham got it. After all he was my partner. I used to call him partner.
Ramesh: Your last movie was in 2003.
Usha Khannaji: Yes. 'Dil pardesi ho gaya'. It was Sawanji's movie. Sonu Nigam, the singer, was very happy about the songs but the movie didn't run. So the songs also sank.
Ramesh: Did you ever in your career feel that your songs would have been popular had the movie been successful?
Usha Khannaji: Many times. But I accept that however good a music director is, if the movie is not a hit, not many people will remember the songs. Only the real music lovers will. Take the example of the movie 'Souten'. The movie was a hit and so were the songs. Nobody will now believe that “Shaayad meri shaadi ka khayal” started as a sentence. Sawanji wrote it. The lyrics “Tumhe chai pe bulaya hai” does not make any meaning. But it was a big hit in the end.
Ramesh: You have answered many questions. But, I would like to ask you one more. Who is your favorite singer?
Usha Khannaji: I like all of them. It depends on the song and the situation. Because each singer has a unique style and class.
Ramesh: You also worked for some TV Serials…
Usha Khannaji: I gave music for the popular TV serials 'Shaktimaan' and 'Kora Kagaz'.
Ramesh: Do you listen to your songs again?
Usha Khannaji: No. It is an old habit of mine. Once I record a song, I leave it and let it be. I know I won't be able to make another one like that…..